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problems with tuning method

On Sat, 27 Mar 1999, Colin Randle wrote:

> start my career on the Tenor Horn, and in response to your aside
> regarding ".....tuning the darn thing", can I offer you - and any other
> interested instrumentalists - some advice that was given to me by a man
> named Malcolm Teasdale, (a fine euphonium player),  who used to give me
> lessons when I was a youngster. He actually gave me a tutor by Boosey &
> Co's, which is so old it looks as if it was printed about 1912,
> obviously before the Hawkes name joined the company.  (Does any list
> member know when Boosey was joined by Hawkes)?

1930

> 
>		      Method Of Tuning The Tenor Horn

Um. This sounds a bit dodgy(see below)

> 
> 
>      First tune the open C natural (third space) with the tuning
>      fork,

fair enough:)

>  then tune the E natural (top space) with third valve,
>      adjusting the third valve slide if necessary, withdrawing if
>      sharp and pushing in if flat - the 3rd. valve should now be in tune. 

This won't work very well-the E on open is naturally a flat harmonic, and
on 3rd it is naturally sharp. This will lead to you tuning your 3rd valve
slide significantly flat (although it's possible that this might be
okay-3rd valve is rarely used on it's own, and when used in conjunction
with other valves, the note becomes sharper anyway(unless the instrument
has compensating valves ( the 'extra' loops of tubing at the back,
which hardly any horns have anyway)), heading back in the right direction.
But more of that below...

>      Next tune open C with 2nd. and 3rd. valves adjusting
>      the 2nd. valve slide as before, if necessary.  

If C on open is in tune, then C on 2+3 is naturally flat-the same harmonic
as the open E before. In addition, if the 3rd valve is already tuned flat,
as above, then even the small sharpness gained by using a combination of
valves is still going to leave this note hopelessly flat. What now? Saw
off bits from the 2nd valve slide?:)

>    The note G
>      (second line) should be tuned open and then with 1st. and 3nd.
>      valves adjusting the first valve slide if necessary.

This might work-though for all the wrong reasons. If the instrument is
compensating, then the flat 3rd valve will leave the note also flat,
particularly as G on open is a sharp harmonic, and G on 1+3 is an 'in
tune' harmonic. If the instrument is non-compensating, then the sharpness
caused by the combination of valves will probably be pretty close to
cancelling this out, leaving you with a pretty closely-tuned 1st valve.

So, if you try this method on a non-compensating instrument, the result
would be:-
3rd valve flat
2nd valve probably quite good in it's initial position, but appears to the
user to be quite flat
1st valve in-tune-ish

not exactly disasterous, but not much good for fine tuning either. If the
instrument is 3-valve compensating(like a modern baritone, for instance),
then the 2nd valve situation applies to the 1st valve as well. If either
of the valves in this position are already pulled out, they will then be
pushed in, making them sharp.

sorry about the tedious detail on tuning-it comes from being a trombonist
and a mathematician

Dave Taylor
University of Warwick band
Rolls-Royce (Coventry) band


> 
> 
> 
> Colin Randle.
> 
> 
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