Stamina

john · Post by **john** » Mon Sep 06, 2004 10:52 am

Well... having recently started to play again after a 15 year absence you can imagine my lips were quite floppy only 3 weeks ago.

I put out the SOS for a Arban book so I could run some lip building exercises.
I was also supplied with a book I knew nothing of. 'How brass Players do it' by 'John Ridgeon'
At first glance it looks like a very basic introduction to 'how to make a sound' ......period ,,,,,,not so!
After puffing through the Arban probably damaging my lips at times I then read and then ran through some of the Ridgeon exercises.. Mainly the sort of stuff you are traditionally taught NOT to do. ie slurring arpeggio's.
The exercises are designed in such a way that you can feel your throat and lips adjusting and growing in stamina and flexibility. By contrast to the Arban the exercises appear very simple to perform, almost a joy! (c-mon, who didn't want to slur everything when they first started to play!) Composed of building and flexibility excercises the player quickly climbs the ability ladder not having to worry about fingering as most exercises are in the 'bugle' style

... I am currently repeating the first half of the book attempting to perfect some of the more demanding exercises before I move onto the books second section where the exercises are taken into the higher register.
Its the weirdest thing- going back to the Arban exercises, triplets arpeggio's and horrible stuff that looks too difficult becomes a breeze firing out like a machine gun.
The book also goes into detail about improved breathing and its ability to aid lip stamina, embouchure etc etc......

My thinking about embouchure is..... if you think you do it wrong don't try to change it overnight... Keep it in the back of your mind making alterations as you play day to day.

Personally I have one top front tooth that overlaps the other. This can become painful when the lips tire and I inevitably apply too much pressure to the mouthpiece in a torturous attempt to hit the highs.
A bit goofy eh!.... in a Tom Cruise sort of way though

Andythehorn · Post by **Andythehorn** » Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:01 pm

I've been playing for a number of years and is too still suffering from having no stamina. This can really be a pain, i've read and tried alsorts of things. some days i will have a brill lip but this only happens every now and again, most of the time playing is hard work, feels bit like when you get up in a morning and the skin on your face is really stiff and tone and range is well.. rubbish!!! and on top of this after mmmmmm bout 20 - 30mins playing the lips start to hurt.

After playing i get a ring round the lips from the mouthpiece, but if i try not to press on, anything above an E/F is hard.

technical ability is fine and so is reading, this is the only thing holding me back. Is this common, did is sound like you

john · Post by **john** » Mon Sep 06, 2004 8:32 pm

yup... sounds like me and probably a lot of other people too.

As I said above im back after 15 years. I played from the age of 8 up until 18. That was 10 years solid, 5 within a championship section band = 3 nights a week

If I had only been introduced to the above mentioned book back then I may have continued....however by the the age of 18 I had had enough.

If you spend a couple of weeks with the 'John Ridgeon' book the Arban tutor is a LOT less intimidating afterwards.

In days gone by I never argued with my music teacher, faithfully and painfully perfecting each exercises in the tune a day and/or arban tutor in the hope the effort would warrant a tick so I could move onto the next torturous script.

but....In one week I have gained more ability than any other week in all my years playing. I spend an hour a day blasting through 30 exercises. In another week's time I expect I will be strong enough to move onto the second half of the book (up to high 'c'), I certainly have more stamina directly attributed to this book which builds you up WITHOUT the pain.

This is the book I highly recommend!
go seek it out!

You can find it HERE if it helps??

Andythehorn · Post by **Andythehorn** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 12:20 am

think i could (and thats a big could) have sorted it. i've started playing using a lot less pressure on the mouthpiece in my last band practice, and when i came to practice the following day i felt really good. not pressing the mouthpiece to hard on the lips is really hard for me but i've given it ago and the results feel so much better. The day after was unbeliveably good too, the range int very good yet but the power and lips feel 100% better.
My main worry is that on wednesday i've got a audition practice with a first section band and my last band is fourth section, i felt i really need to move on so im trying. But this stmina problem has killed my confidence so i'm absolutly scared stiff whats going to happen on wednesday!!!! Oh dear

john · Post by **john** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 11:58 am

good luck!.

Pressing too hard is a very common problem. When lips are not strong enough to last the distance people (myself included) tend to press harder to stop air escaping from the side of the mouthpiece (usually on higher notes)..... This will help but is something to be avoided if you can due to the damage and lack of control it causes.

unfortunately, the time to strengthen lips is precisely when they are fatiguing by trying to hold the note by muscle not pressure. muscles only build when you can feel them working/burning.
Of course this will be painful to the ear when in the middle of a band piece.... thats why its better to run through some building and flexibility exercises yourself.

Andy_WFB · Post by **Andy_WFB** » Fri Oct 15, 2004 12:45 pm

Not pressing is the holy grail!! Especially if you've been doing it for years, it's a hard habit to break.

I found a good technique recently when I found myself as the only solo cornet (everyone else on holiday). Basically, before breathing I position the mouthpiece so that it's resting on the top lip - absolutely no pressure on the bottom lip. Then as I blow I just touch the bottom lip to the mouthpiece - still with the emphasis on the top lip. My upper register is now much stronger and stamina much better.

As the bottom lip is generally more 'fleshy' it's the one the contributes greatest towards the sound and suffers most from pressing, this approach allows the bottom lip to do it's stuff while the top lip takes the strain.

Obviously whatever technique you employ, it's important to warm up properly and get the lips flexible before trying anything too demanding.