my progress

john · Post by **john** » Mon Aug 23, 2004 12:49 am

Hi all,

15 year ago I left a championship section band in the north east to pursue further education (having played from the age of 8 up until that point)..
..A few weeks ago I was enjoying myself digging out some deep Chicago blues riff's on a stratocaster at a friends BBQ. :-

"who do you play for?"
said the sax player
"no one"
I replied "its not even my main instrument"
"what is?"
.......NOw, at this point if you say 'Tennor horn' you usually get a blank look so I replied "Trumpet, Brass band, been playing for years"

So, some weeks later I get a phone call from the sax player I ended up sharing half a bottle of whiskey with that night.....
"Will you come and see our local band, maybe join in?"
After informing him many times that I don't play cornet I finally got the message that they are short of cornet players....so....I now am in possession of a next to new Besson Sovereign cornet (besson sovereign???, when did this happen....where is B&H?)

Anyway, 15 years later and two sections lower I have 3 weeks to get myself up to speed with the more technically challenging front row cornet notation.
Having never played a cornet before I am however quite amazed at the ease at which more complex notation can be tooted with greater almost laser precision by comparison to the Tenor horn.

Having given my Arban tutor away many years ago to a promising beginner all I am left with is a Wright & Round - Soloist's Companion book which I am quite enjoying.
Mainly building up my lip stamina at the moment as I seem to be capable of virtually any musical gymnastics on this new fangled cornet thing but only for the first 2 minutes of each day

.........which brings me to my question........

I know little about the mouthpiece of a cornet.... I 'think' I may be using one that is too small for me.... When I played the Tennor horn I used a Dennis wick No. 2 ..... This cornet comes with a unbranded '5' with a letter 'x' undernieth.... Heh!... brand X I guess..... So, is this small, tiny, medium or large???..... what is it and what are my options???....

Cheers!
3 Weeks before I get back to that band room and knock their socks off!....Hootananny here we come!

john · Post by **john** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 3:08 pm

Had a couple of messages since the last post, so, thanks for the info.
(as I live in the middle of nowhere I can't simply pop down to the nearest music shop for advice so...hail the internet!)

I have had a Dennis Wick No.4 mouthpiece offered to me which I will borrow in a couple of weeks time...meanwhile a Arban has been supplied which I am steadily 'flumpeting' through as lips start to get stronger.

If I can get used to this No.5 then I may stick with it as I find lower notes and good tone to be fine at the moment as dropping to a '4' would appear to reduce the chances of obtaining a good upper register?
We'll see when I try out a DW'4'

john · Post by **john** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 11:10 pm

Ok.... I got the Dennis Wick No.4.

I don't like it.

After several comparisons I have found it only of use for very soft work in the lower octave. I was expecting a fuller sweeter tone... the reverse is true.

for me anyway.

So. ... it looks like I have taken a shine to this old battered No.5 cornet mouthpiece. Sweet and agile.
Could anyone identify it and tell me who makes them? I am considering buying a new one as this one is a bit rough round the edges.
Another possibility would be to get this one re plated at a local jewlers?.....is that a good idea?...I assume they simply dip it into a pot and let it dry?

john · Post by **john** » Sun Sep 12, 2004 10:56 pm

Ok.... so, the only things I have to go on are

No.5 / X / Made in England

So, it looks like its unidentifiable.

The nearest style I have found on the Internet is a CONN mouthpiece. 'Clearance stock'
I seem to remember these for sale in the Dolphin center @ Darlington in the north regionals during the 80's
Whats the word on CONN

.....are they still going?

Next question.... who would have the largest selection of mouthpieces in the north east or Scotland

john · Post by **john** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 12:21 pm

Ok...well.

A internet based mouthpiece shop has promised to send me a selection of second hand mouthpieces to try out...result!.... handy as we live in the middle of nowhere.

I have attended my first two band practices now.
The first one did not go well

Having practiced every day for 3 weeks solid leading up to the day I decided to let my lips rest the day before (as I used to do prior to competitions).....big mistake

I must be still developing the muscles as 24 hours without some exercise lost all that I had built, trout mouth.
Add to this some wacky time and key sigs, odd pattens, very bad tuning (which was not realized until half way through) and my first day was a bit of a mess.
I had a couple of days to pull it back which I think I did quite well....some intensive flexibility exercises weaved into a good study of the pieces the band were playing.
Second band practice went much better indeed however my music is now littered with valve fingering 'tune a day style'.... I can hit the notes, I just need help at the moment remembering what they are.

embarrassing as im playing on the front line but for the moment working

I feel some Arban scale work coming on.

tigger908 · Post by **tigger908** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:52 pm

hiya

http://www.normans.co.uk/pdfs/Vincent%20Bach.pdf

this spread sheet proclaims to an early vincent bach mouthpeice which was branded with an x perhaps its one of theirs.

Tigger

john · Post by **john** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 3:02 am

thanks for the link.....

I am trying out 4 Bach mouthpieces.
Its going to be impossible to try out every size so I took some advice based on one or two questions and we narrowed it down to these.

5C
6C
6
7C

I was immediately impressed with all the above when compared to the Dennis Wick No.4 I tried out which was simply very very flat sounding.
also - All the Bach items produce a tone that is more pleasing than the old piece .....and yet, the Bach mouthpieces seem to be a lot wider than the cup I have been using (which is also a lot deeper than any of the Bach's)..... I had assumed any cup size that was anything close to a DW No.4 would have been a bad move....heh.. guess assumptions are a bad idea when choosing a mouthpiece..

So.... it looks like I am about to loose that vintage cornet sound I have enjoyed over the past month.....but, looks like the greater range of tone a more suited piece will provide will outweigh this.

I have eliminated the 5C straight away simply because the other 3 work better for me.
I can certainly understand why the 7C is so popular as well! .... very little effort is required to achieve accurate and pleasant results, however I found it slightly brash when rendering delicate passages or gunning out a variation or two.
This leaves me with a choice between the 6 and 6C. While I like the crisp attack of the 6C I have to go with the 6 due to its slightly deeper cup allowing more accurate pitching (for me), the tone, although no sweeter is slightly more mellow.

The comparison between the 5-X (unbranded) that I have been using and the Bach 6 is night and day. The 5-X took quite a bit of warming into due to its small size. This made it great for powerful solo parts with that vintage vibrato soaring ahead.
The Bach 6 is by contrast ........ well mannered. Be it FFF or PPP - C,C, or C'eeee its going to offer me the best chance of hitting the spot when it counts. Think I'll stick with the 6 for a year or so and see where it gets me. At the very least I will blend into the cornet section with more ease.

Well.... thats what I think today anyway

john · Post by **john** » Sat Nov 13, 2004 10:26 pm

Settled into the Bach No. 6. but I'm starting to wonder if a larger cup may be better now

..... Don't know if its simply a natural progression of weather or not my muscles are starting to slip. (as I have not been able to put in the 2 hour a day effort I had started with) .....

...anyway, I have just completed the second of 2 (local) competitions in 2 weeks with the band. Having just moved up a section we used the first to iron out the lumps and bumps achieving a respectable 2nd place prior to a WIN in the second competition.

As I got far too drunk last week I have not participated in the victory celebrations today

.... It got a bit domestic last week when I finally got back....woke up the whole street

.

On a second high our junior band has just started competing, gaining 2nd place in the 4th section! Amazing

Looks like I'm out of my honeymoon period now though as I'm running out of excuses when the notes go wrong and I can't blame it on cobwebs anymore. got to get some scale work under my belt. With age comes other problems

. Unlike the early years when you have lots of time but don't want to practice I now find myself wanting to practice with no opportunity to do so.
Its good to be back.

john · Post by **john** » Sat Dec 11, 2004 6:19 pm

Just got given a WD 4B to try.... Its slightly bigger than the Bach 6 I just bought.....

Looks like im going to have to start to use it!

Much less brash tone so I should blend in better.... Guess its just everything changing as I progress. So, 2 steps forward and one back.... The larger mouthpiece is like one back at the moment as I have to build back up to the high notes and sharpen that tongue.
Cant deny its a better tone and possibly better for quieter passages.

hey ho.... Guess I will be wanting to use a DW 4 or larger next

john · Post by **john** » Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:54 pm

well,,,,,,,, its half a year since I started to play the cornet.

Im starting to outgrow the Denis Wick No.4B. Think I need a '4' or possibly a '5' now

The 4B I have been using was kindly given to me in exchange for a pint (which I still owe

) .... very rough round the edges so I sanded it, filled it with car Chemical Metal, sanded it smooth again then sprayed it white with a can of white paint. bit of T'cut and it is good as new. Although everyone seems to think its plastic now.
But I need a 4 maybe a Dennis Wick 5 now, (see my classified's post)

I decided to enter a local solo compo... I thought I had nothing to loose and after all, it encourages you to practice a bit more.
Predictably it was not all smooth but I achieved my first goal, to find out where I stand so I can start to progress.
Wow, the top 6 finalists were stunning! ... Standards have certainly gone up since I left the banding movement .. and so young! ....So pleased to have taken part if only for the oportunity to here some of the others play.

Back to Variations for Brass now.

"Bom Bom Bom bo~bo~bom"

john · Post by **john** » Mon Feb 14, 2005 3:46 pm

From one extreem to another.

Just borrowed a 2B .... its like a bucket.

Certainly melowed out the low notes and everything else as well.
Most noticeable improvement is articulation especially with triple and double tounging. didd'nt expect that! For sure the upper register (although no more difficult) will require additional practice as stamina seems to deminish quicker....but thats probably a teething issue.

Im buisy trying out 'the paragon' at home. Certainly more pleasing with the 2B
The 4B sounds very tinny and strained now.

I only have one issue with the 2B, it could be too big as I seem to be sounding more like a Flugal at times.

After some research it appears that the 2B is a common backrow mouthpice as its mellow.
Is it wise for me to get used to such a wide cup playing on the front row ?

john · Post by **john** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 9:38 am

Now using a DW3

And it feels too small at times.
guess I really HAVE to get used to this one as the only other option is a DW2.....which is aiming for a small bore trombone sound according to the DW blurb sheet.

anyway..... the 3 sounds a bit more mellow down low and seems to offer more potential for dynamics.
Happy again.

john · Post by **john** » Fri May 27, 2005 5:16 pm

Think I have found my ideal mouthpice, still using the DW3 since the regionals.
I occasionaly try out the old 4B just to compare my progression..... the 'B' cups are certainly easier for high notes but the B cups DO limit dynamics and articulation.

Im starting to work through the flexibility exercises again and solo work for the forthcomming solo compo's...... I don't know if I should stick with LaBelleAmericane or my new flavour of the day Fantacy Brilliant .... I always assumed the Arban solo was untouchable however, as I have been intensively studying 'the paragon' the Arban solo's last variation is more achievable for me at the moment than the ending of LaBelleAmericane.....also it has no killer slow section in the middle or any high notes.!and yet seems to be respected as difficult enough for a competition.

I have just about reached a stage where key sig's dont bother me as well......about bl00dy time too! Although insane 5 sharp nightmares are still an issue!
Plus I have started attending our junior band by choice....... My main problem is stamina in the lead up to these compo's and one of the things I rarely practice is low volume controlled long notes and yet the junior band do nothing but long notes for well over an hour! good endurance building..... I identified so many fundamental flaws by playing with them.... Problems best address by re-attending basic instruction at a much lower level.

Personal practice: I have reached a point where the Arban is enjoyable, ie. I seem to be over / through the physical building barrier which can restrict your view on books such as the Arban to nothing other than an obsicle or simply pages that proove your rubbish. The Arban can be soul destroying if your introduced too early to it...... I only understand this now!

anyway, back to the studies.

john · Post by **john** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 10:01 pm

I have decided to start to complete the 2nd half of the 'how brass players do it' book.
Im more or less able to competantly play the first half of the book at various speeds without cracking notes.
I need to be able to successfully strike cleanly above top 'A' to get the best from the solo's Im working with. not only strike them but play them musically.....
The second half of the ridgedon book has to be my first step.
Got to start pushing the momentum along and the main obstacle I can see is a lack of range.

Started to play 'merry go round' by W. Rimmer.... Kanny little ditty this one

Meanwhile the paragon is getting crisper with each day.

Sight reading has improved a lot... Starting to break down the bars increasingly faster as I remember more and more patterns.

I also need to get stuck into some chromatic runs and endurance tounging excercises out of the Arban..

I now believe that the Arban studies regarding triple tounging are not as helpful as they could be. Im starting to develop my own excercises which appear to be springboarding my technique by comparison. As the Arban studies rely on perfect physical condition and stamina the triple tounge section seems to hinder more than help.

I have also been introduced to PC notation programs over the past 3 month..... Got the beginning of a quartet I call 'the dare devil' and a slow melody based on a midi file which I am adapting for a local competition (with jazz guitar accompaniment) ....that should be interesting on the day

well, it was either that or misty !

john · Post by **john** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 8:42 pm

In approx one months time I will have been playing for one year.
Stating to hit cleanly above top A now without forcing the note, upper range is starting to cruise now. about time as well

Got to really work on 'on demand' top C's now. Key sigs are not too much of an issue any more as long as we dont go above 3 sharps.
Im very pleased that I appear to be still gaining ability month on month. Last month I was very close to exchanging my DW3 mouthpiece for a DW4 but, I am now glad I stuck with it, Mouthpiece shape and size was very much on my mind from week to week as I started to get back into playing brass all those months ago... Looks like it must take up to a year for your lips to get back into a stable form.
The main thing holding me back now is sight reading/scales..... So, its intensive scales from now on. as long as I keep seeing improvement Im going to be happy. What makes it a bit more difficult for me is that the whole band is rapidly improving as well due to our MD being sucsessful with us....so, Im running quite a bit to catch up with the train all the time.

I really got into the notation program but silly little things like knowing how to delete not only the contents of a bar but the bar itself have been holding me back.
Finished my solo for the compo and started a duet which I extended to a trio which may or may not be ready to perform by the time of the compo.....depends on what the others think of it.
It was suggested that I have a go at a hymn to start me off with a full band score..... Seems like a massive undertaking to me at the moment but hey!....after a couple more little solo's and stuff I may give it a go.